Art De La Guerre

[Dickstick]

I have a swordsman behind and in group contact with a bowman.
The bowman has a cavalry move up into ZoC.

Does it shoot its way out of trouble or Evade?
Where does an evade get us?

Using 2 cp it moves back 1ud and takes a disorder as per p37.
Expensive but could be worse being ridden down by cavalry.

Now what's the swordsman doing while this is going on?
It's been interpenetrated but not fully crossed so its position has to be adjusted p39 bullet 3. It seems to me it is pushed forward to the original position of the bowman as this is the minimum necessary to clear the bowman base.

Have I got this correct?
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Player 747 don't call me Jumbo

[Hazelbark]

SwBW_CV

IF I understand it is the above. CV is an enemy
Bow do not evade so I am not quite getting your point.

The BW back up 1 UD, but this is not far enough to clear the SW. So the sword are displaced to their rear. So you have not done much.

in the bullet 3 you cite it reads "moved back or pushed". So in this case the Sw would not be pushed forward.

The pushed/displaced unit is never* going to move forward.

*Never from memory not looking at rules.


practically the Sw should slide and move up so when the CV charge the BW (bow will get a shot off this turn) the Sw will then have a flank attack next turn after offering support.

The obvious is the Sw advance through the bow but do not contact the CV and if necessary the BW get moved backwards.


All the above and I admit I may not follow correctly.

[Dickstick]

The bowman was in a line of HI swordsmen having replaced the HI swordsmen that was now behind.
Cavalry (enemy naturally, as one does not ZoC ones own troops) come up and ZoC the line.

Only way for the bow to exit the ZoC is to evade so looking at p37, units that cannot evade, bullet 2, we have the bowmans move.

For the HI swordsmen p39 adjusting position bullet 3 we have.
In other cases the crossed unit is moved back OR pushed the minimum necessary to make room for the crossing unit.

2/3 forward is shorter than 1 ud backwards.
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Player 747 don't call me Jumbo

[fdunadan]

You'd better charge the Cav(if not impact) with your HI.
If you stay and the Cav is alone, it will be overlapped on two sides in fight. Unlikely to win, especially after being shoot at.

Exiting ZoC must be reserved for very extreme situation and this seems not to be one.
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Audentes fortuna iuvat.

[Za Otlichiye]

Looks fine to me, given they are heavy swordsmen. They will end up 10mm (or 20mm) short of the bowmen's original position.
If they were medium, then they cannot be partially crossed, so the bowmen cannot interpenetrate, so I think they are stuck. IIUC they cannot push back the swordsmen.

The swordsmen could move forward through the bowmen, avoiding the Disorder penalty, IIUC.

[Snowhitsky]

Hmmm, i am actually with Dickstick on this one.

It does say “the crossed unit is moved back or pushed the minimum necessary to make room for the crossing unit”.

It does not say “the crossed unit is moved back to its own rear”.

My reading is the crossed unit moves in the opposite direction of the crossing unit so the HI get shunted forwards towards the CV. The HI cannot then move.

[Ramses II]

Agreed. Where the LMI bow are supported by MI sw, no interpenetration is possible because the 1UD rearwards movement is insufficient to "at least partially reach the other side".

Where they are supported by HI sw, the LMI bow move back 1UD effectively swapping places with the HI sw.

[Zoltan]

And if the HI are mounted on a 40x40 base for aesthetic reasons does this change anything?

[Dickstick]

[Mike Bennett]

[Ramses II]

I see where you are coming from, Mike, but since this is in the context of passing through the friends, I would say that means the unit must “pass beyond” as you put it.