Art De La Guerre

[micheni]

hi all
after our second game with paris its time to start questioning the specialists and find the answers for this nice game cause we have to push time fast and prepare ourselfs for a nice journey in france for some wine and a few games.
3 units of each side fight each other in the number player turn

xxxwwwzzz
111222333
after combat unit 222 is routed and unit www advanced to pursue. so...

xxx
111www333

what are the options for unit www.
a) turn to frontally contact the flanks of either 111 or 333 using normal move ? does this count as a flank charge with the apropriate consequenses
b) stay there and give support ?
c) charge the flanks of either 111 or 333 making a normal charge move ?
d) move straight ahead ( searching for another victim!!!) or back
e) or something else?
f ) conform how and where ?

it happened several times and we think its very basic trick in this game so we would like to have a clear picture for it
thx in advance
micheni de mavrouna earl of ithaca

[Soranon]

Hi Micheni!

First of all,www unit can only pursue if it's belong to the active player. It means that www cant pursue on the other player's turn. The pursue is optionnal unless www is impetuous

a) www can conform on 111 or 333 on a later turn. It's not a charge but it cost one loss to either 111 or 333if www isn't a ligth troop.

b) www can also stay and give support to xxx or zzz

c) It's impossible to charge 111 or 333 because www is on corner at corner contact.Only conformation is possible in this case if you want to figth. This means that there's no impact or devastating charge.

d) www can also move straigth ahead or turn back. Be careful that it's impossible to go throuth unit in figth so interpenetration is impossible during the move.

f) Conformation is always done in the same way : "Attacker" unit must be placed front corner against the front corner of the unit it's taking in flank or corner at corner of the rear side of "defender" unit. The front oh the "attacker" touching the flank or the rear of the "defender". If it can't be done (because of lack of space or because of zone of control) the contact is illegal. So in this case, no figth...

I hope I'm clear ?

[lionelrus]

And so, as www can only pursue when the letters is in phase he can't pursue and turn enemy's flank immediatly after: the number player alway has a turn to play (and come whith another unit for contact or zocing www)
_________________
"Quand on a pas de technique, faut y aller à la zob"
Perceval à Yvain et Gauvain.

[micheni]

thanks very much for this fast response .your answer is very clear and helpfull.
....(a) www can conform on 111 or 333 on a later turn. It's not a charge but it cost one loss to either 111 or 333if www isn't a ligth troop.) ...does this cost a cp or is free as conform? and if i got it right the element makes a flank contact with front corner to front corner as we did it in DBM to stop recoil and have an auto kill result.

[Soranon]

It's not a free conformation because 111 or 333 are already in figth. So it cost you 1 or 2 PC depending type of troop www is.

It's the same as DBM but it's not auto kill if defender unit loose (it depend of the result and of the losses)

For example : A pike unit attacked by two legionary (one in front and one in flank , it's not impact fight but melee) will loose 1 "hit point" and will fight at -1 (0 as being taken in flank and -1 because of desorder). Legionnary in front of it will figth at +2 (+1 base +1 support). So on average dice result (like 4-4) the pike unit will loose only 2 "hit points"

[papadopp]

So if I get things right

A single unit (not light troops)charges an opponent's unit to his flank or rear - the defending unit is NOT already in melee
1. CPs are expended (except for a spontaneous charge)
2. NO cohesion loss
3. Basic factor reduced to 0
4. Abilities are cancelled (impact, javelin, furious charge etc.)

A unit (not light troops) contacts to the flank or rear by charging, moving or conforming (if it was already in contact) an enemy unit which is already engaged in melee
1. CPs are also expended (conform is NOT free)
2. IMMEDIATE cohesion loss by 1 point
3. Basic factor reduced to 0
4. Abilities are cancelled (impact, javelin, furious charge etc.)

A light troops unit makes the above
1.All others are valid - NO cohesion loss though

Two units (one not of light troops) contact the same enemy at the same face - the non - light troop contacts the enemy in the flank or rear
1. CPs are also expended (conform is NOT free)
2. IMMEDIATE cohesion loss by 1 point
3. Basic factor reduced to 0
4. Abilities are cancelled (impact, javelin, furious charge etc.)

[belinconnux]

Hi papadopp,

If i understood you are right for all

good games
_________________
Hasta la victoria Siempre!
Peter Lord dobeul impact

[papadopp]

Thank you bellinconnux
The reason I am asking is that (and that maybe was the main argument I had with my good friend micheni) in the QRS it is stated "Attacked in flank or rear AND multiple opponents etc. - LOSES 1 COHESION IN MELEE
So if these two conditions are different, it means that when a unit is attacked in his flank or rear by an enemy unit, it ALWAYS loses a cohesion point, regardless of if it is engaged in melee to his front - or not?

[Soranon]

No, a unit attacked in his flank or rear loose only 1 cohesion for this if it's already engaged in melee.

For example, if in the same turn the unit is charged by two units, one on his flank, one on his rear, it will loose one cohesion point too.

Figthing against two or more opponent cause one cohesion loss (Sorry I said Hit points yesterday because I didn't know exactly how it is translated in english version)

Good games, Papadopp

[papadopp]

Merci bien Soranon
We are looking forward to see you all in a tournament in France - it won't be long till then